Emotional Affair and intimacy

[blondegirly]

Do you think that if a married man has an emotional affair with a Married woman that he lacks intimacy in his marriage?

[elizacol]

Emotional intimacy, most likely, yes. Physical intimacy, not necessarily, but perhaps.

I was not the greatest communicator, nor very demonstrative with my love. (Quite the opposite of many marriages, where the male fits that stereotype).

My husband NEEDS communication and affection, as he did not get either as a child. I generally don't. (Again, the opposite of the norm of male/female beings).

This led to problems, of which we are now working together on.

Is this something you are dealing with? I've been down that road if you'd like to talk.

[blondegirly]

Emotional intimacy, most likely, yes. Physical intimacy, not necessarily, but perhaps.

I was not the greatest communicator, nor very demonstrative with my love. (Quite the opposite of many marriages, where the male fits that stereotype).

My husband NEEDS communication and affection, as he did not get either as a child. I generally don't. (Again, the opposite of the norm of male/female beings).

This led to problems, of which we are now working together on.

Is this something you are dealing with? I've been down that road if you'd

like to talk.

Hi, I would like to talk. I have been having and emotional affair with a MM, I am a MW. The whole thing started as friend's with an attraction. He lives nextdoor to me so this is very difficult. Th affair has gone on for over a year. Lot's of talking aboyt sex, hugging touching but NO actual sex. At on point over the summer I told him I was in love with him. I told him I would leave my H for him. He told me he loves his wife.? I am so confused by his words and action's. We have a very deep connection, I believe we are soul mates, he has sort of agreed with me.

In Nov I told my H about the affair but left out many details because I could not hide it anymore. I was crying all the time, not sleeping and thinking of MM every single minute. I was so mad one night I told MM that I was going to tell his wife since my H knows, maby with it out in the open we could stop? He told me he told his wife beacuse he was afraid I would. I am not so sure I believe him. Anyway we are in NC and it's so difficult. I just don't understand how he could love his wife like he claims to after all he and I have shared.

Thank's

[ThunderHorse]

One of the first steps to end an affair, recommended by Marriage Builders website, is to bring the affair out into the open.

Do you have children? Does he? What are your plans for the children?

It sounds like your neighbor is less than fully honest with you, so it would be difficult for you to accurately assess if he were your soul mate, or just a good huckster.

What do you feel is missing in your marriage? How could you help your husband develop some habits that would bring you more joy? What habits would you like your husband to change?

[elizacol]

blondegirly,

Wow! This is definitely a moment/sign of growth for me. Even a month ago, the fact that you were (are) the MW in an emotional affair with a MM would have made me detest you and judge you instantly.

You see, I was the unsuspecting wife whose husband got emotionally involved with an unhappy MW.

Instead, I find myself able to 'talk' to you without any feeling whatsoever, except a desire to help and offer whatever I can to you.

Understand, I am seeing it from the wife's pov, and that which I have gleamed from my husband through our talks. So, I don't know how much I can be of help.


As for your confusion about how he can love his wife and yet be deeply involved with you. It is entirely possible.

You are filling some void in his life. I can't tell you what void that is, but you are most definitely filling a void. I will throw a few out here, but it may or may not be one of the following:

1) a need to feel desired/attractive/wanted/appreciated (a 'getting older' thing)
2) need for excitement (married life can get dull if it is not stoked frequently)
3) need for someone to 'understand' him (lack of communication w/his wife)

The above really have nothing to do with 'love' per se.

Let me ask you something.

How much of the REAL you does he see? How much of the REAL you do you allow him to see of you?

By the same token, how much of the REAL him do you think you see? How much of the REAL him do you think he allows you to see?

How much of your affair is built on fantasy and not on reality?

At the end of the day, it is the spouses who see the REAL deal. The yelling, the pouting, the laziness, the lack of affection, the poor parenting, yada yada yada (I just threw a bunch of things out there as examples).

None of that is usually seen during an affair. Hence the fantasy, not reality.

Anyway, I digress.

Personally, I do think the wife needs to know and no, I don't think he has told her. Trust me, he is doing everything in his power to NOT hurt his wife. Telling her about his affair would hurt her, and he isn't going to do that unless he is cornered and has no choice.

You may ask, well, isn't having an affair hurting her? Yes, but not as long as she doesn't know. In his eyes, if she doesn't know, it isn't hurting her.
Her knowing would hurt her.

Understand, by bringing it out into the open, your MM WILL have to make a choice. His wife isn't going to allow him not to (unless she's an idiot).

What Thunderhorse said is correct, one way to bring about an end to an affair is to bring it out into the open. Affairs thrive on secrecy. Without secrecy, they fizzle. Part of the excitement is the secrecy.

One last thing.

Whatever flaws that exist in you that resulted in your having an affair are still going to be there even if you do end up with your MM.

Same goes for him.

Whatever flaws he has within him that has resulted in his having an affair with you are still going to exist if he decides to leave his wife and be with you.

Personally, I would work on YOUR flaws, whatever they may be. I would encourage him to do so as well.

The core issue isn't the affair. It's the lack of 'whatever' within each of you that is the issue and needs to be dealt with so that you both become 'whole'. Whether 'whole' together, or 'whole' apart.


By the way, my husband and I are working together much better now that we ever did before. His 'need' for her began in August of last year, dissipated gradually from May-Sept. By October, we were on the road to healing because all contact and desire for contact with her stopped.

I can honestly say, had he not done what he did, we would not be where we are today. So much growth has taken place within each of us as individuals, which in turn has resulted in growth as a couple. I am such a better person and wife and mother now that I was before we went through this.

Let me know if you need anything else. I do tend to be wordy. Sorry!

[blondegirly]

blondegirly,

Wow! This is definitely a moment/sign of growth for me. Even a month ago, the fact that you were (are) the MW in an emotional affair with a MM would have made me detest you and judge you instantly.

You see, I was the unsuspecting wife whose husband got emotionally involved with an unhappy MW.

Instead, I find myself able to 'talk' to you without any feeling whatsoever, except a desire to help and offer whatever I can to you.

Understand, I am seeing it from the wife's pov, and that which I have gleamed from my husband through our talks. So, I don't know how much I can be of help.


As for your confusion about how he can love his wife and yet be deeply involved with you. It is entirely possible.

You are filling some void in his life. I can't tell you what void that is, but you are most definitely filling a void. I will throw a few out here, but it may or may not be one of the following:

1) a need to feel desired/attractive/wanted/appreciated (a 'getting older' thing)
2) need for excitement (married life can get dull if it is not stoked frequently)
3) need for someone to 'understand' him (lack of communication w/his wife)

The above really have nothing to do with 'love' per se.

Let me ask you something.

How much of the REAL you does he see? How much of the REAL you do you allow him to see of you?

By the same token, how much of the REAL him do you think you see? How much of the REAL him do you think he allows you to see?

How much of your affair is built on fantasy and not on reality?

At the end of the day, it is the spouses who see the REAL deal. The yelling, the pouting, the laziness, the lack of affection, the poor parenting, yada yada yada (I just threw a bunch of things out there as examples).

None of that is usually seen during an affair. Hence the fantasy, not reality.

Anyway, I digress.

Personally, I do think the wife needs to know and no, I don't think he has told her. Trust me, he is doing everything in his power to NOT hurt his wife. Telling her about his affair would hurt her, and he isn't going to do that unless he is cornered and has no choice.

You may ask, well, isn't having an affair hurting her? Yes, but not as long as she doesn't know. In his eyes, if she doesn't know, it isn't hurting her.
Her knowing would hurt her.

Understand, by bringing it out into the open, your MM WILL have to make a choice. His wife isn't going to allow him not to (unless she's an idiot).

What Thunderhorse said is correct, one way to bring about an end to an affair is to bring it out into the open. Affairs thrive on secrecy. Without secrecy, they fizzle. Part of the excitement is the secrecy.

One last thing.

Whatever flaws that exist in you that resulted in your having an affair are still going to be there even if you do end up with your MM.

Same goes for him.

Whatever flaws he has within him that has resulted in his having an affair with you are still going to exist if he decides to leave his wife and be with you.

Personally, I would work on YOUR flaws, whatever they may be. I would encourage him to do so as well.

The core issue isn't the affair. It's the lack of 'whatever' within each of you that is the issue and needs to be dealt with so that you both become 'whole'. Whether 'whole' together, or 'whole' apart.


By the way, my husband and I are working together much better now that we ever did before. His 'need' for her began in August of last year, dissipated gradually from May-Sept. By October, we were on the road to healing because all contact and desire for contact with her stopped.

I can honestly say, had he not done what he did, we would not be where we are today. So much growth has taken place within each of us as individuals, which in turn has resulted in growth as a couple. I am such a better person and wife and mother now that I was before we went through this.

Let me know if you need anything else. I do tend to be wordy. Sorry!

Hi, You sound like an increible person, very strong. You have asked me so many question here I will do my best to answer them. How much of the real him and me are we showing one another? For both of us It's just about 100 percent.

We have known one another for almost 10 years. The past 3 very well. When I say we talked it was never about beign miserable with our spouses. Infact I never really told him how unhappy I had become with my H. He knows something is missing but not to the full extent. We mostly talked about life, sexual fantasies thing's like that.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said we both lack something in ourselves and perhaps our marriages and that's what lead to the affair.

I am working with a therapist now to sort out my feeling's. I am not sure how much of this was a fantasy, I really like MM. We have a strong desire for one another in many way's.

I think that we both don't want to hurt our familes, nor give up the comfy lifestyle that we both have. "I remember him saying to me once", Ya know we both have it pretty good". Anyway, Thank's for your advice. I guess time here is the key.

[ThunderHorse]

Other Man or Woman Forum

The Love Shack has a forum section for the other man or other woman.
http://www.loveshack.org/forums/f57/

To understand what needs are not being fulfilled in your marriage, and what needs you are fulfilling for your married neighbor, you might look at the Emotional Needs Quesionaire on hte Marriage Builders site.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forms/enq.pdf

Another stragtegy used in Marriage Builders is the No Contact letter. You write your married neighbor a letter detailing how you will avoid contact with him, and give your husband a copy of the letter. Maybe also give his wife a copy of the no-contact letter.

As Eliza mentioned, part of your attraction for your married neighbor may be because you have not fully identified how you would like your marriage to improve. Maybe you have some ideas for improvements, but have not been able to find ways to change to make the marriage more fulfilling for yourself.

[elizacol]

bondegirly,

One thing I meant to include up above, but forgot. I didn't mean to imply that it was just you and/or just MM who had flaws they needed to work on. So, too, most likely, does your husband and MM's wife.

My lack of communication and lack of an outward display/demonstration of love for my husband was a flaw that I didn't see that I had. IF my husband and I were to make ANY progress, that flaw had to be dealt with.

I certainly don't want you to think that I was implying that only he and you needed to look within. All parties do. No one is perfect, nor can we perfectly meet another's needs. But we do need to try to meet those needs that are most needed by our spouse(s).

For my husband, who grew up in a home with little love and no recognition or acknowledgement, his need to be shown love and to be understood/listened to/acknowledged is VERY strong. THAT is his flaw, but my actions (flaw) also played a role in his turning to someone to meet those needs, as I wasn't meeting them the way he needed them to be met.

Also, the effort you are putting into this affair is taking away from your marriage, as you aren't putting forth the same effort towards your own marriage and spouse. Same goes with MM.

Really, until you decide to do that, nothing is going to change, until 1 or the both of you decide, 'enough'. You will continue putting forth the effort into the affair, and your marriage will continue to deteriorate.

Anyway, I wish you luck in figuring all of this out. Life isn't easy, but each struggle provides an opportunity for us to look within and 'grow' as a person. I hope at the end of this, no matter the outcome, THAT is what you will have to hold onto. A piece of clarity, growth, wisdom, whatever.

The struggles you are going through now will be worth it if you do.

I never thought I would be saying this, as the past year was very painful for me, but I learned from it and really am a better all-around person. My husband is, too. I am a pretty hard-headed person. Nothing short of what happened would have had the same results. For that, I am thankful for everything that happened.

[blondegirly]

elizacol and thunderhorse,

You both have made some very good point's. My therapist also told me about th NC letter. I do not wish to do that, however I am sticking to NC. I have a feeling that MM has moved on to someone new. He really need's so much attention from woman. My therapist think's he narrsisitc (sp) and from what I read about men like these they are not worth anyones time. I think his wife will be in for it oneday meaning he will get cuaght doing something with someone and that will be the end of their marriage I won't be the one to end their marriage some OW will. I am not sure what's missing in my M but am willing to work on it to find out.

Thank's

[ThunderHorse]

Dear Blonde Girl,

You are to be congratulated in a number of respects. First that you are willing to enter therapy, and are following through.

That you did not actaully go over the line from an Emotional to a real affair, is commendable.

It sounds like you are out of the FOG that affairs sometimes take on, which clouds the faults of the Other Man or Other Person. It sounds like you are working to gain an accurate picture of his strengths and weaknesses. Good luck on No Contact. Maybe just a wave, and "HI" to avoid looking overly unfriendly.

You may not wish to disclose if you have children. But one reason I asked is because taking parenting courses has brought my wife and I closer, each of hte three times we took parenting courses. If nothing else, we were discussing issues in the same terms. I recently shopped on E-bay and bought some tapes and videos that were helpful. My wife is resistant to admitting that any ideas except form her freinds and relatives, might have any merit, at this point in our relationship.

Even if your children are no problem, enjoying your children more together can enhance your marriage. Here are some Links for references on parenting couses, in case you or other readers want to check out the possibilities:


PARENTING COURSES


Nurturing Parenting by Stephen J. Bavolk, Ph. D. Nurturing Parenting Courses and Materials
1-800-688-5822

Web Link:
http://www.nurturingparenting.com/

Parenting Books, Courses and Videos

AP, Active Parenting by Michael H. Popkin. Ph. D.
Active Parenting Web Site


Tough Love Parents Manual by Phyllis and David Yourk


Aware Parenting Institute:
Web Link:
http://www.awareparenting.com/instruct.htm

Instructors for awareparenting .com Phone: 805-968-1868, California, or E Mail [email protected]

for Parent Effectiveness Training instructors in your area, Phone, 800-628-1197, or 858-481-8121, or E-Mail to [email][email protected].[/email] Gordon Training, Parent Effectiveness Training

Gordon, Parent Effectiveness Training, PET
Web Link:
http://www.gordontraining.com/




This is a Link to parenting instructors: Instructors trained in awareparenting.com
805-968-1868, California,
Web Link:
http://www.awareparenting.com/instruct.htm

E Mail, [email protected]




Boundaries With Kids, Raising Great Kids
by Dr. Henry Cloud and Dr. John Townsend, Zondervan, Grand Rapids, Michigan 49530.

Boundaries, Face to Face (2003) by Henry Cloud and John Townsend

cloudtownsend.com Link:http://www.cloudtownsend.com/
www.drhenrycloud.com
www.newlife.com


ODD, Oppositional Defiant Disorder

WHAT PARENTS NEED TO KNOW ABOUT ODD, by Dr. James D. Sutton, Ed.D. docspeak.com, docspeak.com, James Sutton, Parenting and Oppositional Defiant Disorder


Internet Search for "Step Parenting"

stepparenting.com
StepParenting.com

step-parenting.com
Step-Parenting.com

[blondegirly]

Dear Blonde Girl,

You are to be congratulated in a number of respects. First that you are willing to enter therapy, and are following through.

That you did not actaully go over the line from an Emotional to a real affair, is commendable.

It sounds like you are out of the FOG that affairs sometimes take on, which clouds the faults of the Other Man or Other Person. It sounds like you are working to gain an accurate picture of his strengths and weaknesses. Good luck on No Contact. Maybe just a wave, and "HI" to avoid looking overly unfriendly.

You may not wish to disclose if you have children. But one reason I asked is because taking parenting courses has brought my wife and I closer, each of hte three times we took parenting courses. If nothing else, we were discussing issues in the same terms. I recently shopped on E-bay and bought some tapes and videos that were helpful. My wife is resistant to admitting that any ideas except form her freinds and relatives, might have any merit, at this point in our relationship.

Even if your children are no problem, enjoying your children more together can enhance your marriage. Here are some Links for references on parenting couses, in case you or other readers want to check out the possibilities:


PARENTING COURSES


Nurturing Parenting by Stephen J. Bavolk, Ph. D. Nurturing Parenting Courses and Materials
1-800-688-5822

Web Link:
http://www.nurturingparenting.com/

Parenting Books, Courses and Videos

AP, Active Parenting by Michael H. Popkin. Ph. D.
Active Parenting Web Site


Tough Love Parents Manual by Phyllis and David Yourk


Aware Parenting Institute:
Web Link:
http://www.awareparenting.com/instruct.htm

Instructors for awareparenting .com Phone: 805-968-1868, California, or E Mail [email protected]

for Parent Effectiveness Training instructors in your area, Phone, 800-628-1197, or 858-481-8121, or E-Mail to [email][email protected].[/email] Gordon Training, Parent Effectiveness Training

Gordon, Parent Effectiveness Training, PET
Web Link:
http://www.gordontraining.com/




This is a Link to parenting instructors: Instructors trained in awareparenting.com
805-968-1868, California,
Web Link:
http://www.awareparenting.com/instruct.htm

E Mail, [email protected]




Boundaries With Kids, Raising Great Kids
by Dr. Henry Cloud and Dr. John Townsend, Zondervan, Grand Rapids, Michigan 49530.

Boundaries, Face to Face (2003) by Henry Cloud and John Townsend

cloudtownsend.com Link:http://www.cloudtownsend.com/
www.drhenrycloud.com
www.newlife.com


ODD, Oppositional Defiant Disorder

WHAT PARENTS NEED TO KNOW ABOUT ODD, by Dr. James D. Sutton, Ed.D. docspeak.com, docspeak.com, James Sutton, Parenting and Oppositional Defiant Disorder


Internet Search for "Step Parenting"

stepparenting.com
StepParenting.com

step-parenting.com
Step-Parenting.com

Thunderhorse, Thank's for the info. I do have a children, they are good kid's. I will say that this affair was mostly emotional but there was a big physical part to it as well, even though we did not have sex. NC seems to be working and I am feeling stronger than ever before.