Question for Married Men?

[blondegirly]

Hi,

I was wondering if the married men on this forum could help me out here. I have been involved in a Emotional Affair for about 1 year with a close frined who is married.

The whole thing between us started with flirting and lot's of eye contact. We started talking on the phone a couple of day's a week, I always called him. I told him one day of my very strong attraction to him and the feeling was mutal. All of this lead into hugging, some touching and talking about sexual thing's on the phone. I have wanted to go further but he has been afraid to cross that line. Knowing that this is all going NO where, I have ended contact with him for now. I have been unhappy in my marriage and am trying to find a way out that's best for my children.

The thing that bothers me most here is that he does not think that he has cheated on his wife in his words "We did nothing wrong, Most of this was in your head". I think I was played here and it makes me so mad. How can he be so happy in a marriage if he can on the sly talk to me about thing's that two married people should only discuss with their spouse. Any comments would be helpful.

[MarineOfficer]

I have been that man before (I am not sure if to the same extent as your guy, but I will cop to the emotional infidelity line), so I guess I'll take a stab at your question. Obviously every man is different and has different reasons and motivations, but I can give you my little piece of pie.

There is plenty of research and reading out there that will state that men have a very good brain for compartmentalizing things. It is one of the basics of Dr. Gray's mars/venus theory. I do not know if this is true, or if men have simply accepted it and now make it true by acting like it. But I know that I can very easily seperate what I do with my wife from what I do anywhere else. Just like I will not curse around my parents and sister, but can rattle of an armlength about your ancestry at work.

When I did what I did, I simply moved the line a bit. "This is not cheating, because I am not doing X." X can keep moving to the right, until you are caught, and your wife shines the big bright light of honesty into the deep dark recess of your psyche, and you have to honestly admit that you pretty much punted that one into the stands. "Well, I didn't kiss her...I only kissed her once, on the lips...she went down on me, but I didn't do anything to her..." You get the general drift.

Additionally, many men (not me personally, but I have encountered this amongst many friends and colleagues) have a certain perception of their wife as a model of something (model-wife), and are in certain marital routines that they are comfortable and "happy" with. They have never explored outside those realms, and do not intend to. They are content. But then something new comes along, something that is interested in them, something that challenges those routines.

So you contine in your routine, still happy, but you also explore this new thing. Instead of just eating your dinner, you start eating the cake, too. And as in life, eventually you get fat. But who wants to admit that you are fat? Instead you just buy bigger pants. Instead you just say that you are happy in your marriage, and you stop eating cake, disavow any knowledge of the cake, and move on in life. A year from now those bigger pants will be normal to you.

[blondegirly]

I have been that man before (I am not sure if to the same extent as your guy, but I will cop to the emotional infidelity line), so I guess I'll take a stab at your question. Obviously every man is different and has different reasons and motivations, but I can give you my little piece of pie.

There is plenty of research and reading out there that will state that men have a very good brain for compartmentalizing things. It is one of the basics of Dr. Gray's mars/venus theory. I do not know if this is true, or if men have simply accepted it and now make it true by acting like it. But I know that I can very easily seperate what I do with my wife from what I do anywhere else. Just like I will not curse around my parents and sister, but can rattle of an armlength about your ancestry at work.

When I did what I did, I simply moved the line a bit. "This is not cheating, because I am not doing X." X can keep moving to the right, until you are caught, and your wife shines the big bright light of honesty into the deep dark recess of your psyche, and you have to honestly admit that you pretty much punted that one into the stands. "Well, I didn't kiss her...I only kissed her once, on the lips...she went down on me, but I didn't do anything to her..." You get the general drift.

Additionally, many men (not me personally, but I have encountered this amongst many friends and colleagues) have a certain perception of their wife as a model of something (model-wife), and are in certain marital routines that they are comfortable and "happy" with. They have never explored outside those realms, and do not intend to. They are content. But then something new comes along, something that is interested in them, something that challenges those routines.

So you contine in your routine, still happy, but you also explore this new thing. Instead of just eating your dinner, you start eating the cake, too. And as in life, eventually you get fat. But who wants to admit that you are fat? Instead you just buy bigger pants. Instead you just say that you are happy in your marriage, and you stop eating cake, disavow any knowledge of the cake, and move on in life. A year from now those bigger pants will be normal to you.

Hi There, Thank's for your reply, I understand much better now. I also read your post about the flirting husband. I am glad to see that you respect your wife enough not to do that to her, especially in front of her. The guy I was involved with always flirt's in front of his wife. Infact if there is an attractive woman in the room he whould chat her up all night, have seen him do this many times, pretty pathetic. My husband might be a jerk sometimes, but never in that way I am glad for that.

[happy in PA]

For me, the one instance when I became involved in what you term an emotional affair was in direct relationship to a very trying time in our marriage. My wife and I went through three-years of hell. Sex was non-existant. Communication was negligible, and just when I was most vulnerable I found myself working with a bright, very attractive, divorced woman who thought the same of me.

We became friends and then close friends. We would stop after work for a drink together with "the guys". Once or twice we stopped alone. We joked about the fact that our department all thought we were having an affair. I beleive I commented that if, "I was getting the blame its a shame I wasn't having the fun".

It would have gone farther, but we never found a time when both of us were ready to take the final step. One or the other of us would be ready, but never both of us at the same time. Finally, I told my wife that we either had to start communicating or separate. My wife asked if there was someone else and I told her no, but that I was infatuated with this other person. I am sure I didn't really have to tell her. That night was the last night I ever spent in close contact with my friend. While we never came close to sexual intimacy I did love her. I do love her, or at least my ideal of her, but my marriage and my daughter had to come first.

Fortunately my wife respnded to my pressure and we began to communicate and put our relationship back together. In a sense, that emotional involvement saved our marriage. It gave me a sense that there could be something good out there for me and gave me the incentive to either put my marriage back together or get out. Without that push I think my wife and I may have drifted along for another period of time before giving up.

We didn't turn things around overnight, but they got better... or at least bearable. It was probagly another 12-15 years before we really turned the corner for good and put it all together. Now we are somewhere I never imagined we could be in our marriage. I thank the Lord daily for our stubborness and/or commitment to one another to hang on long enough to get here.

[happy in PA]

I should have noted in my post above that for me the biggest factor in the entire relationship was needing a sense of being desirable to someone. My wife wasn't making me feel wanted or desired, but this other person gave me a sense that I was viewed as bright, attractive, desirable, etc. That was the key.

When I say I loved her, I do mean that. There was a genuine affection between us. I will always miss our friendship. If we had met at different times in our lives we each believed that there could have been more to the relationship. As it is, there is just the pain of knowing that something might have been, more than soothed by the knowledge and reality of what I have.

[blondegirly]

I should have noted in my post above that for me the biggest factor in the entire relationship was needing a sense of being desirable to someone. My wife wasn't making me feel wanted or desired, but this other person gave me a sense that I was viewed as bright, attractive, desirable, etc. That was the key.

When I say I loved her, I do mean that. There was a genuine affection between us. I will always miss our friendship. If we had met at different times in our lives we each believed that there could have been more to the relationship. As it is, there is just the pain of knowing that something might have been, more than soothed by the knowledge and reality of what I have.

Hi Happy in Pa,

I am so glad for your post's. After 1 year of an emotional affair and now in NC, I am still looking for answers. NC just started in December and was intiated by him. He told me if we contiune our friendship that something would end up happening between us, I am sure he meant we would have sex. We had somewhat of a PA, but no intercourse. What I don't get is how he could say he is "happily married" and be in a EA with me. He even said if he was not comitted to someone else I would be at his house all the time. We shared a very special connection. I admit I am not happy in my M right now. He is also the type of guy who loves to talk to woman, especially very attractive ones. So how can he be so happy with W if he need's other woman around him so badly?

[happy in PA]

<<So how can he be so happy with W if he need's other woman around him so badly?

Since I don't know either you or the other party it is hard to comment.

There could be many reasons. Maybe he is so narcisistic that he feels like he has to be the center of attention and specifically the center of women's attention.

<<What I don't get is how he could say he is "happily married" and be in a EA with me. He even said if he was not comitted to someone else I would be at his house all the time.

From what you have said in an earlier post you seem to see this relationship as much deeper than he does. He doesn't seem to see it as an EA. Maybe he doesn't acknowledge the reality of such a relationship. For him it could be a "No Sex, No Affair", mindset.

Just some thoughts.

[blondegirly]

<<So how can he be so happy with W if he need's other woman around him so badly?

Since I don't know either you or the other party it is hard to comment.

There could be many reasons. Maybe he is so narcisistic that he feels like he has to be the center of attention and specifically the center of women's attention.

<<What I don't get is how he could say he is "happily married" and be in a EA with me. He even said if he was not comitted to someone else I would be at his house all the time.

From what you have said in an earlier post you seem to see this relationship as much deeper than he does. He doesn't seem to see it as an EA. Maybe he doesn't acknowledge the reality of such a relationship. For him it could be a "No Sex, No Affair", mindset.

Just some thoughts.

Hi, He has told me that he realized that we had a major EA. Narcisistic, this could very well be the case. I guess he makes me wonder. I also am missing him very much right now. He know's that I have an incredible desire for him, infact almost 1 year ago when I asked him if he would be interested in a "A", his comments' were "Very, Very much so. I find you to be incredibly attractive and fun". Also stated that his wife was like chicken you can only do so much with it", a hamburger is always nice every now and then." What did he mean by that?

[elizacol]

I know *I* wouldn't want to be considered hamburger.

Perhaps the men can shed some light on what that means
from a man's pov, but the way I read it...it says a lot
about how he views you.

Perhaps I'm wrong.

[elizacol]

Personally, if he *still* seems interested in you, you need to give
him an ultimatum.

You or his wife.

Same goes for you.

YOU need to decide. This guy or your husband.

What you are (both?) doing now is playing a game. It's not real
life. You are living under the illusion of 'what might have been'.

The only way to find out 'what might have been' is to
quit the game playing and make a decision. Him or your
husband. You can't have it both ways, and neither can he.

Well, you can, but obviously it isn't working/doesn't create
the happiness/life you are looking for.

If he doesn't still seem interested in you (hence the NC),
then you need to quit obsessing over it and realize that he chose his wife and/or other women over you (since you say he seeks that attention of many women).

IF he really wanted to take it to
the next level with you, he would have.

He didn't, he hasn't.

You can continue to obsess over this or you can learn
from this, become a better person, and move on
with your life.

Your choice.

Either demand an ultimatum from him (and likely
not be happy with the answer you receive)
or
move on.

Either way, you must move forward.

Do you know the joy you are missing in
life because you are stuck in this rut
of 'loving' someone who isn't even
available? You are doing it to your-
self.

Sorry if this sounds harsh, but I
actually feel badly for you. I
know *I* wouldn't want to feel
as you do.

The thing is, you don't *have*
to feel this way. What you have
to do is take steps to facilitate
your 'moving on'. Whether that
means with him solely or without
him solely.

Where you are now is stuck in
the middle. Not a good place to be.

As for *why* he can 'say' he loves
his wife yet have an EA. Well, does
it really matter? Is having an
answer really going to ease your
pain, solve the problem, make it
all better? I doubt it.

Face it, some guys, just like some
women, are jerks. No other
explanation needed.

[happy in PA]

I have to agree with Elizacol. You each have to make a decision. What or who is important to you? Do you want to salvage your marriage?

Frankly the other party sounds like either a manipulative cad, or a really mixed up guy.

[elizacol]

Sadly, men like him will continue to be the
way they are because there are enough
women in the world who 'allow' them
to continue doing what they do.

From the sounds of it, this guy 'loves'
the attention of other women, and isn't
hesitant to seek it out. All the while,
his wife is (possibly) aware of it, the
'other woman' is aware of it.
Both putting
up with his 2-timing and flirtations
with other women.

What person without a moral
code of conduct wouldn't do
what this guy is doing? After
all, he is essentially
being allowed to have his cake
and eat it, too.

Rant over.

[Scott Haltzman]

Also stated that his wife was like chicken you can only do so much with it", a hamburger is always nice every now and then." What did he mean by that?

Perhaps the men can shed some light on what that means
from a man's pov, but the way I read it...it says a lot
about how he views you.

Well, Elizacol and Girly,
I'm a guy, and I don't know what that comment may have meant. I can say one thing--it doesn't sound very complementary!

S.H.

[happy in PA]

As I re-read the thread I can't help but feel that he was just throwing out a line to see if he got a bite.

I have to agree with Elizacol, I wouldn't want to be considered hamburger.

I'm no counselor, but it seems to me your safest action is to run, not walk, in another direction.