A question for the men

[elizacol]

Since this forum is mainly for men, I pose a question to you. Perhaps the women reading here might gain some useful insight.

Here's my question:

If you could ask your wife or sig. other to do or change 3 things that would make you happier, what would they be?

Patriarch...I know your answer will be more sex. Ok. Got it. Now, open your mind and entertain some other thoughts.

Life, after all, is multifaceted. Even the horniest (your word, not mine) men need more from life than sex.

[first year]

1. More love and affection (not just sex)
2. More love and affection (not just sex)
3. More love and affection (not just sex)

That's it. Men just want love and affection.

[elizacol]

Wow!

Isn't that what women want, too?

Why, then, is marriage so difficult for some? (rhetorical question)

Truthfully, I believe you wholeheartedly. All spouses really need to remember is to treat each other with love, kindness, and respect.

Everything else would fall into place.

Thanks for responding!

[happy in PA]

Elizacol,
I would have similar thoughts but my three would be:

1) I try to be sensitive to my wife's needs. I would appreciate some more understanding of my needs, not just sexually. For example, I am basically an introvert. My wife is not. She needs others around her constantly. Occasionally I would like to not be treated like I am some hibernating curmudgeon if I don't jump at the idea of getting together with others.

2) A greater sense of appreciation (Despite improvement in our relationship, I still usually feel like my efforts in the relationship, around the house, etc., are usually unappreciated.) Nothing I do has ever seemed to be enough.

3) Less focus on things and more focus on us.

[elizacol]

happy in PA,

Thanks for responding. I am very glad you did, as I
(and my husband, ultimately)
really benefit from
hearing from the men's pov.

I know my husband's needs are similar to your own.
He has told me as much.

It serves as a reminder of what I need to be doing.

For whatever reason, as women, it is very easy to 'forget' that our husband's really need to be shown appreciation!

I have gotten very proficient at understanding
and allowing for his needs. That has come
easily.

I really need reminders about the
whole appreciation thing, though.

Which is why I'm glad you responded.

I know over the weekend, my husband did
more than his usual. On Monday, I sent him
an e-mail thanking him for his help. That
night, he told me that all day he had been
thinking about what he could do that night
to help out with things because my e-mail
had motivated him. I thought, what a strange
response...one I would have never expected.

It's not why I sent it, and had he sent me
something similar, I wouldn't have had
that reaction, but...men and women are
definitely different and we need to under-
stand that and APPRECIATE that. (and accept it!!)

[happy in PA]

I remember taking a sociology course in college, "The Family". In an early lecture the professor stated his opinion that the phrase that most thrills a woman are, "I love you". For a man he opined that the phrase is, "I am proud of you".

I'm not sure I agree 100%, but it does point out how we are wired differently.

[elizacol]

Interesting...I have never heard that.

[Travis E]

Although my marriage is all over but the crying, here's my list:

1) To be warmer in general. (i.e. mannerisms, tone, and general congeniality)

2)To say exactly what you mean.

3)To take what I say at face value. (I had, "unless in anger" there, but after thinking about it more, I wouldn't be nearly so angry if she didn't go off on tangents so much.)

[elizacol]

Travis,

You know, even if your wife is 'certain' she wants a divorce, there is still hope.

You mentioned in another thread that you could not afford to move out.
Which means, I presume, that you 2 will still be living in the same house?

Well, there is your opportunity! Much easier to try to save a marriage when you are still in the same house than when 1 has moved out.

Are you truly interested in saving your marriage? Are you willing to make the changes that you need to make in order for your marriage to work?

It won't be easy, but, as you know, neither is divorce. Looking at the end result, after a lot of HARD work, where would you rather be? Divorced? Or with your wife?

[ThunderHorse]

1. Respect

2. Inspiration

3. Ego Boost.


My wife is more about demanding than appreciating.

My wife is more about caring about me and telling me what is for my own good, rather than respecting my judgements.

My wifeis more about finding fault, rather than fashioning praise.

My wife is more interested in fitting into her church ideas, relatives and friends ideas, rather than my sense of justice.

I am personally taking more responsibility to ask for what I want, and to look for motivational structures to support my wishes in my wife's belef systems.

Thanks for your contributions to the forum.


.

[elizacol]

Thunderhorse,

I'm glad you responded to this older thread. It serves as a reminder to me of what my H needs (easy to slip into old habits). I am far better than I used to be, but there are still times when I get selfish and think only of myself. I find that when I think of my H first, I, too, get what I need in return. Funny how that works.

Why, I wonder, to men need such ego boosts? I've often wondered, as it was a source of hurt in our early years. I didn't need the boosts, and therefore never dreamed that my husband did. So, I never gave any. Turns out, that is one of the things he really needed and resented, because I didn't give them to him.

On the flip side, I also wonder why women place so much emphasis on what others (friends, family, etc.) think...trying to impress others, rather than remain focused and concerned about what her husband thinks.

What drives these internals 'flaws'??? (Rhetorical question)

[happy in PA]

Elizacol,
Part of the answer to your question of course goes back to "different wiring" for the genders. I think part of it also deals with perception.

As boys, we are taught to be sure to tell the significant females in our lives how nice they look, how good dinner was, etc. Most females are receiving those "ego boosts" all the time. They may be so ubiquitous as to go un-noticed and recognized for what the ego boosts they are. Men on the other hand do not usually get the same kind of comments.

After many years of difficulty I finally manged to explain to my wife the I always knew she needed me, I just seldom felt that she wanted me. She I know had the opposite problem. She knew I wanted her, but she had doubts as to whether I needed her. I think I understood her problem a lot more quickly than she understood mine.

After 33-years my wife and I greet each other on the phone as "beautiful"and "handsome". We both realize that we are not the physical specimens we were in our 20's, but we know that in each other's eyes we are still beautiful and handsome.

A couple years ago as I dressed for my first day at a new job I turned to my wife and asked if my attire was okay. I was going to be working in a corporate office in the heart of one of the 3 or 4 largest cities in the country. It had been years since I had done that and dress codes have changed a lot. My wife's response was, "I'd do you!" What a boost. I went off to the day like I was walking on a cloud. Nothing could have gone wrong that day. I try to do things to give my wife that same feeling.

And to think, it only took us 30-years to figre it out.


Happy in PA

[nocruelty]

Elizacol,

My biggest frustrations are with assumptions made about my intent and arguing with me about what my words mean.

After 4 years of marriage, this one issue is sucking the life out of me.

I'm pretty good at simply saying what I mean. My wife may choose to interpret what she wants, but rather her seeking clarification, we then start arguing about my intent behind my words (rather than taking the words at face value).

In the end, she takes the victim/martyr approach, saying that she's all wrong as usual, that I've won again, that she's the problem.

I've oft explained to her in calmer times how difficult it is to remain loving when she's wrongly telling me what I'm feeling or when she's completely off-base in insisting on what motivated me to say some things (i.e., her claimed motivation being far different than anything truly behind my words).

When it flares up, at this point I've typically lost faith that there will be any positive outcome and either I just shut up (she feels abandoned) or spit back the exact ugly words that she tells me ("No, I'm not a immature. I think you're projecting."), which does little to comfort her.

My wife has many wonderful qualities. Her own insecurities in taking everything so personally (and reading into everything that may come out of my mouth) is the one thing that if addressed, would be a tremendous gift to me and our marriage.

But, it's happening so frequently that it's getting increasingly harder for me to climb back out. After another run-in last night, this morning I just left the house for work without saying good-bye. First time that happened, and I'm numb to really care much about it.

[elizacol]

Nocruelty,

Whew! That's a tough one. I feel for you, as I know how difficult it can be to live with someone whose self-esteem is low. Because that sounds like the problem...low self-esteem. Would you agree with that?

I wish I had more advice for you. I know with my H, I have to choose my words carefully, as he also takes things very personally. This stems from his childhood and his feeling of lack of worth.

It helps me to remember that is 'issues' stem from his upbringing. Doesn't make it easier to take, but easier to understand.

Does your wife have issues from her childhood that might be causing this low self-esteem?

[ThunderHorse]

Dear Elizacol,

I wrote this response two weeks ago, but it did not go through

Yours was the last thread on Aim to Please.

I have been studying the Eggerichs approach to Love and Respect, Books, DVD's, website.

Last night I attempted to describe to my wife some of our differences in motivations. Not to persuade her to change, just a description.

Chairs is the desire for Respect by Men, Conquest, Hierarchy, Authority, Insight, Relationship and Sexuality.

Conquest is like my job, and interests. I mentioned that my wife is concerned about my wearing a workman's uniform. She is concerned that even though I make more money than many guys wearing suits, that her concern is for her respect from her friends and relatives.

Heirarchy. I probably have different evaluations of people, and their relative importance, compared with her evaluation. I mentioned this so that we could both be considerate of our differences of evaluations and opinions.

Authority. I think that my wife should ask me before throwing any of my stuff away. My wife believes she has the authority to throw my stuff away, under various circumstances.


Then my wife started to explain that I did not sufficiently fully accept Jesus, and that she was concerned that something so simple, would cause me to burn Hell for eternity. She has taken on the beliefs of the Right Wing. I had asked her last week why the Christian Bible leaves out Lillith, the first woman made by God, before Eve. Might have set her off.

For Women, the Love needs are Couple. Closeness, Openess, Understanding, Peacemaking, Loyalty and Esteem.

Eggeriches desribe the crazy cycle as de-energizing, as husbands and wifes fail to give each other Love and Respect.

The Energizing Cycle is supposed to work Wives giving Respect and Men giving Love. As men give more love they receive more respect. As Wives give more Respect, they receive more Love.

The Eggerichs claim that is only from not knowing, that wives do not give their husbands the respect the desire. I think there are a range of altruistic and selfish motivations that make giving Respect to a husband, a challenge, and in conflict with Her needs.

I am working on better understanding my wife's motivations that conflict with my desire for Respect. I may never get more Respect from my wife, but I feel better able to ask for what I want, which is recommended in the Secrets book.

Blessings
.